MSU pres. Resigns

[Gulo Blue]

Now, I'm not a doctor, but I have a hard time understanding how it wasn't mind-blowingly-obvious to everyone - not just actual medical doctors - that fingering the vag and groping and massaging breasts could not possibly be considered valid medical treatment for lower back pain, a sore hip, a high ankle sprain or any of other typical sports-related injuries gymnasts commonly suffer.

Even chiropractors don't officially go that far, and they claim all sorts of absurd shit.

What's easier to believe, 4 doctors, on the record, defended a monster and said a bunch of mind-blowingly-obvious stuff wasn't true, or the 4 doctors weren't presented with the mind-blowingly-obvious facts?

 

[hungry]

Another thing with MSU fans bringing up Gibbons. It's almost like they don't realize that the head coach was fired, the AD was removed, and I think the president of the University has since been replaced...

Am I wrong about the president of the University?

Sure, they weren't removed for the Gibbons thing, but it was there.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Another thing with MSU fans bringing up Gibbons. It's almost like they don't realize that the head coach was fired, the AD was removed, and I think the president of the University has since been replaced...

Am I wrong about the president of the University?

Sure, they weren't removed for the Gibbons thing, but it was there.

I haven't seen a lot of MSU fans bring up Gibbons.

 

[hungry]

I haven't seen a lot of MSU fans bring up Gibbons.

Wow! You must have your head in the sand. Go to any mlive article on the subject of MSU. There are references to Gibbons all over any of the articles I see on fb. There are tweets all over the place bringing up Gibbons. It's everywhere.

Saw a tweet just the other day that referred specifically to mgoblog and brown haired girls.

 

[Michchamp]

What's easier to believe, 4 doctors, on the record, defended a monster and said a bunch of mind-blowingly-obvious stuff wasn't true, or the 4 doctors weren't presented with the mind-blowingly-obvious facts?

because some or all (??? I don't know which, but it doesn't affect my reasoning either way) had professional ties to Nassar, honestly I could go either way.

...but I have incredibly low expectations for my fellow humans, and our institutions these days.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Wow! You must have your head in the sand. Go to any mlive article on the subject of MSU. There are references to Gibbons all over any of the articles I see on fb. There are tweets all over the place bringing up Gibbons. It's everywhere.

Saw a tweet just the other day that referred specifically to mgoblog and brown haired girls.

I checked reddit, here, and facebook. A little MGoBlog, but not past the first couple comments.

Bringing Gibbons up doesn't even make sense. Charges against him were dropped. That's one of the common defenses I've seen for Izzo and Dantonio.

 

[Gulo Blue]

because some or all (??? I don't know which, but it doesn't affect my reasoning either way) had professional ties to Nassar, honestly I could go either way.

...but I have incredibly low expectations for my fellow humans, and our institutions these days.

Yeah. That's pretty dark.

 

[hungry]

I checked reddit, here, and facebook. A little MGoBlog, but not past the first couple comments.

Bringing Gibbons up doesn't even make sense. Charges against him were dropped. That's one of the common defenses I've seen for Izzo and Dantonio.

I know. That is what I was saying. Although, the charges were never dropped. They never existed. There were never any criminal charges brought against Gibbons. That is what happens when the accuser states that she didn't know if she had given consent or not and stops cooperating.

That isn't what happened in the Payne/Appling case. The accuser claimed that there was no consent and that she wanted charges to be pressed, but was told, "no."

 

[hungry]

https://www.landof10.com/michigan-state/michigan-state-basketball-travis-walton-tom-izzo-basement

Here is the article talking about Travis Walton living with Izzo. Seems so odd to me.

 

[hungry]

Payne has been cut since this stuff surfaced on friday, as well.

 

[Sbee]

I know. That is what I was saying. Although, the charges were never dropped. They never existed. There were never any criminal charges brought against Gibbons. That is what happens when the accuser states that she didn't know if she had given consent or not and stops cooperating.

That isn't what happened in the Payne/Appling case. The accuser claimed that there was no consent and that she wanted charges to be pressed, but was told, "no."

if the litmus test is charges being filed, there were only 4 players in that report who were charged and they were kicked off the team without due process, without finding if they were guilty or innocent.

Also, it's factually incorrect to say the Appling/Payne situation was without consent, she did consent to sex with both of the players. In the middle of it, she said that she felt that she couldn't leave, although she was not told she couldn't leave or restrained, it was what she thought. We've been over this before but the players were cleared legally.

Any situation where charges were filed resulted in the player being dismissed immediately

 

[hungry]

Well, I've already admitted that I don't know exactly what happened. I don't think any of us do...well, except sbee, I guess. Seems to me that she consented at first and then withdrew it, is what she is claiming, still claiming to this day.

It sure is a good thing we have Sbee here to set us straight on these things, as if he was an eye witness or something.

In previous reports on the incident, one of the players has stated that he felt uncomfortable with the situation and left. I assume that player to be Payne.

All we are doing at this point is guessing, though.

Charges weren't filed, even though the police and the accuser wanted them to be. This is the distinction I was making to the Gibbons case. The Gibbons accuser didn't pursue charges and the police didn't ever recommend there to be charges.

 

[Sbee]

Well, I've already admitted that I don't know exactly what happened. I don't think any of us do...well, except sbee, I guess. Seems to me that she consented at first and then withdrew it, is what she is claiming, still claiming to this day.

It sure is a good thing we have Sbee here to set us straight on these things, as if he was an eye witness or something.

In previous reports on the incident, one of the players has stated that he felt uncomfortable with the situation and left. I assume that player to be Payne.

All we are doing at this point is guessing, though.

Charges weren't filed, even though the police and the accuser wanted them to be. This is the distinction I was making to the Gibbons case. The Gibbons accuser didn't pursue charges and the police didn't ever recommend there to be charges.

The only people who know what happened were the people that were there. I simply know what the prosecutor determined, which was that there was no crime that was committed.

https://detroit.sbnation.com/michig...5808/michigan-state-basketball-sexual-assault

The Assistant Prosecutor (Debra Bouck) who initially screened this case met with the woman who reported the incident. At this point, the case was still under review. Ms. Bouck explained the legal process. As is the standard practice of this office, Ms. Bouck also questioned the Complainant regarding specific details of the incident, which were not covered in the police interview. This was done so that the young woman would understand the types of questions that she would be called to answer should the matter go to court, and also because we need to know the answers to those questions in evaluating the case.

Following this interview, Ms. Bouck indicated to the young woman that she still needed for the police to speak with a potential witness before any final decision was made. Following that further investigation, Ms. Bouck called her to indicate that no charges would be filed. Ms. Bouck also indicated the rationale for her decision and that the young woman could come in to meet with her to discuss this matter. Ms. Bouck then reviewed the case with Chief Assistant Prosecutor Lisa McCormick, who agreed with the decision.

There have been numerous reports that indicate that one of the two men "corroborated" the story told by the woman. However, the prosecutors who reviewed this case examined not only the police report, but also the actual interview of one of the men. I have attached transcripts of the police interview with one of the accused men. You can see from the transcript of the interview with the man that he did not, in fact, corroborate the facts necessary to substantiate a criminal sexual assault charge.

Based on our review of all of the materials, including the police report, actual interviews, and the specific details that were elicited directly from the Complainant, our office reached the conclusion that no crime had been committed. We therefore made the decision to decline to bring charges against the two young men.

 

[Gulo Blue]

One thing I'm surprised I haven't seen criticism for, is MSU hiring Pepper Hamilton to give a verbal report the way Baylor did. That's one of the thing that led me to believe the president should resign - spending money to avoid transparency.

 

[hungry]

Well, I sat down to watch the e60 thing and discovered that my program guide lied to me and it recorded some show about Carson Wentz instead. It is airing again tonight at 1am EST according to my program guide. During that show, they interview Shaner, the accuser in the Payne/Appling case. I hope my program guide is right this time.

 

[Gulo Blue]

I do also think ESPN is being a bit manipulative with some of the reporting. MSU leadership hasn't been transparent AND ESPN is being sensationalist to the point of smearing reputations that may not deserve it.

 

[hungry]

The only people who know what happened were the people that were there. I simply know what the prosecutor determined, which was that there was no crime that was committed.

https://detroit.sbnation.com/michig...5808/michigan-state-basketball-sexual-assault

The Assistant Prosecutor (Debra Bouck) who initially screened this case met with the woman who reported the incident. At this point, the case was still under review. Ms. Bouck explained the legal process. As is the standard practice of this office, Ms. Bouck also questioned the Complainant regarding specific details of the incident, which were not covered in the police interview. This was done so that the young woman would understand the types of questions that she would be called to answer should the matter go to court, and also because we need to know the answers to those questions in evaluating the case.

Following this interview, Ms. Bouck indicated to the young woman that she still needed for the police to speak with a potential witness before any final decision was made. Following that further investigation, Ms. Bouck called her to indicate that no charges would be filed. Ms. Bouck also indicated the rationale for her decision and that the young woman could come in to meet with her to discuss this matter. Ms. Bouck then reviewed the case with Chief Assistant Prosecutor Lisa McCormick, who agreed with the decision.

There have been numerous reports that indicate that one of the two men "corroborated" the story told by the woman. However, the prosecutors who reviewed this case examined not only the police report, but also the actual interview of one of the men. I have attached transcripts of the police interview with one of the accused men. You can see from the transcript of the interview with the man that he did not, in fact, corroborate the facts necessary to substantiate a criminal sexual assault charge.

Based on our review of all of the materials, including the police report, actual interviews, and the specific details that were elicited directly from the Complainant, our office reached the conclusion that no crime had been committed. We therefore made the decision to decline to bring charges against the two young men.

Why do you keep doing this? I'm not even talking about this. I'm talking about the difference in the Gibbons case where the accuser didn't pursue charges and the police department didn't recommend charges. In the Payne/Appling case, the accuser did pursue charges and the police did recommend charges.

Everyone knows that the prosecutor didn't bring charges.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Well, I sat down to watch the e60 thing and discovered that my program guide lied to me and it recorded some show about Carson Wentz instead. It is airing again tonight at 1am EST according to my program guide. During that show, they interview Shaner, the accuser in the Payne/Appling case. I hope my program guide is right this time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LygQIDneEWw&feature=youtu.be

 

[hungry]

I do also think ESPN is being a bit manipulative with some of the reporting. MSU leadership hasn't been transparent AND ESPN is being sensationalist to the point of smearing reputations that may not deserve it.

Well, I guess that is to be determined at this point. Sounds like everything will be investigated.

 

[hungry]

thanks for the video, Gulo. I have data streaming issues at the house here, so I'll hold off for now. Hopefully, i get it recorded tonight.