Stafford ranked 13th

[kdp80]

Funny how he needs an "explosive" rb to produce worthy numbers.

 

[tomdalton22]

I'm just using your "logic" and I use that term very loosely! If INTs are because Stafford throws so much so are his TDs & yards. Look at his career adjusted yards per attempt...6.55. Active players that are ahead of him:

Rodgers
Rivers
Romo
Manning
Brady
Ben
Brees
sSchaub
Newton
Ryan
Garrard (LOL)
Vick
Palmer
Cutler
Dalton
Flacco
Stafford

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/pass_adj_yds_per_att_career.htm

That is not very good.

Stafford is not Awesome...he isn't even very good...he is just average with some potential due to his age.

It's funny...if you look at that list and take out Garrard, Palmer and Vick Stafford is 14th. You could probably take off Schaub as well since he has hit a wall.

Of course there are 3 young guys in the league that are probably on par with Stafford as well (probably a little better) in Luck, Wilson and Kaepernick. Like we have been saying....he is just average!

 

[grandy]

Not his fault his team got hurt, his RBs/weapons are so turnover prone (fumbles and causing ints too) and his past defenses can't hold a lead. Mainly 2012.

Stafford is the lowest of the low reason why we lost so many games. Many times he's the only reason we are even in games.

So Mayhew has done a poor job of building a team with quality depth around Stafford?

If Durham is so shitty, why was he on the team? Surely there must have been somebody better on waivers?

Great QBs are usually capable of overcoming team weaknesses to consistently win which is why I have a hard time putting Stafford up there.

Going off the list that Tom gave and comparing it to team performance over the course of their careers.

Rodgers (58-29, .667)
Rivers (79-49, .617)
Romo (63-45, .583)
Manning (167-73, .696)
Brady (148-43, .775)
Ben (95-47, .669)
Brees (110-75, .595)
Schaub (46-44, .511)*
Newton (25-23, .521)
Ryan (60-34, .638)
Garrard (39-37, .513)*
Vick (58-48-1, .547)*
Palmer (64-73, .467)
Cutler (56-48, .538)
Dalton (30-18, .625)
Flacco (62-34, .646)
Stafford (24-37, .393 and for the sake of argument, removing the first 2 years...21-27, .438)

* - "active" but no longer a factor

Stafford and Palmer are the only QBs with a record below .500, don't you see some sort of correlation between statistical success and team record? The higher you go up the list, the more likely you are to see a winning record and likewise the further down on the list, the more likely you are to see a losing record.

Either Stafford is not that good or management has done a poor job of putting together an offense or a combination of the two. I don't buy an argument that includes none of those.

 

[LKP]

So Mayhew has done a poor job of building a team with quality depth around Stafford?

If Durham is so shitty, why was he on the team? Surely there must have been somebody better on waivers?

Great QBs are usually capable of overcoming team weaknesses to consistently win which is why I have a hard time putting Stafford up there.

Going off the list that Tom gave and comparing it to team performance over the course of their careers.

Rodgers (58-29, .667)
Rivers (79-49, .617)
Romo (63-45, .583)
Manning (167-73, .696)
Brady (148-43, .775)
Ben (95-47, .669)
Brees (110-75, .595)
Schaub (46-44, .511)*
Newton (25-23, .521)
Ryan (60-34, .638)
Garrard (39-37, .513)*
Vick (58-48-1, .547)*
Palmer (64-73, .467)
Cutler (56-48, .538)
Dalton (30-18, .625)
Flacco (62-34, .646)
Stafford (24-37, .393 and for the sake of argument, removing the first 2 years...21-27, .438)

* - "active" but no longer a factor

Stafford and Palmer are the only QBs with a record below .500, don't you see some sort of correlation between statistical success and team record? The higher you go up the list, the more likely you are to see a winning record and likewise the further down on the list, the more likely you are to see a losing record.

Either Stafford is not that good or management has done a poor job of putting together an offense or a combination of the two. I don't buy an argument that includes none of those.

Stafford producess. INJURIES. Concentrated ones. Injured secondary in 2012, hurt Best,Young,Burleson, Pettigrew,Broyles in 2012. 2013 Burleson, Calvin, Broyles, Pettigrew and Bush for some games. It got all the way done to Durham. The offensie still produced well but the turnovers screwed Stafford (fumbles, ints not his fault). Lions didn't get the turnover support. Stafford has to deal with much more than any QB. Yet still produces. You should on your knees being thankful that we have him as our QB. We can win a Super Bowl with him with just a little help.

Everyone higher than Stafford had much more help. Be it turnovers, run game, healthier weapons more explosive.

 

[grandy]

I won't bow down to Stafford.

However I'm sure that none of these QBs on the list have ever had to deal with injuries either or "fluke turnovers". It's only something that happens here in Detroit.

 

[mhughes0021]

Burleson and Pettigrew couldn't make them pay enough. Not big YAC guys. Completion % was fine to both of them by Stafford and the RBs. Then there were some injuries causing shit Durham to play. Durham can't beat single coverage.

And 6 man fronts are bad for QBs. More guys in coverage going against nickel most of the time. Makes it tougher for the QBs. It's like you know nothing about football.

if he was asked to "do a lot"....like you say then hed check out and run the ball. But hes not asked to do much. Its like you know nothing about football.....

 

[tomdalton22]

I won't bow down to Stafford.

However I'm sure that none of these QBs on the list have ever had to deal with injuries either or "fluke turnovers". It's only something that happens here in Detroit.

nope...just Stafford!

 

[LKP]

if he was asked to "do a lot"....like you say then hed check out and run the ball. But hes not asked to do much. Its like you know nothing about football.....

Check out and run is not the best option on 2nd and 3rd and long. Passing underneath is the best way to move down the field. And he does it well. Running the ball more is clearly not the answer. It's like you know nothing about football or down and distance.

And Lions were still 14th in attempts. They ran it plenty. Pay attention hughes. You seem to be clueless.

 

[cheeno]

I'm all aboard the Stafford train this year because of what he's got around him, but if he doesn't produce I'm pulling the emergency brake on this choo choo. Someone will try to shovel in more coal saying he's in year one of a new offense but fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice? You won't get fooled again.

 

[LKP]

I won't bow down to Stafford.

However I'm sure that none of these QBs on the list have ever had to deal with injuries either or "fluke turnovers". It's only something that happens here in Detroit.

Bow down. You are taking him for granted. He's a very good QB.

They may deal with the same injuries but they may get more defensive support, more turnover support, more run support and less fumbles by weapons. Stafford has to deal with all of that.

Stafford is the most criminally underrated player in the entire league.

 

[tomdalton22]

Bow down. You are taking him for granted. He's a very good QB.

They may deal with the same injuries but they may get more defensive support, more turnover support, more run support and less fumbles by weapons. Stafford has to deal with all of that.

IF this POV is true then you are conceding that Mayhew has put a team together that turns the ball over too much, doesn't play good defense and can't run the ball.

 

[grandy]

I'm all aboard the Stafford train this year because of what he's got around him, but if he doesn't produce I'm pulling the emergency brake on this choo choo. Someone will try to shovel in more coal saying he's in year one of a new offense but fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice? You won't get fooled again.

Completely agree

Would love to see Stafford put up monster numbers with a new offense and new weapons, perhaps even see the Lions win for a change, but it's never a guarantee. We can all give ourselves the warm fuzzies knowing that every thing that happened last season was "bad luck", but it has no impact on this upcoming season.

 

[grandy]

Bow down. You are taking him for granted. He's a very good QB.

They may deal with the same injuries but they may get more defensive support, more turnover support, more run support and less fumbles by weapons. Stafford has to deal with all of that.

Stafford is the most criminally underrated player in the entire league.

Winning consistently is the best way to combat "underratedness". Do that and I'll gladly give Stafford all the credit he deserves.

 

[LKP]

IF this POV is true then you are conceding that Mayhew has put a team together that turns the ball over too much, doesn't play good defense and can't run the ball.

They do turn it over too much. Doesn't mean the weapons aren't good though. Some bad luck in there with recovery rates. The pass pro is fine. And some of that is due to concentrated weapon injuries as well causing some picks and fumbles. I'll take Bush and Bell despite the fumbles.

Defense needs to force more turnovers. It's a big reason why Schwartz got fired. They do alot of other good things but the turnovers will come with a new aggressive scheme. I'd say turnovers were more scheme than anything since our Dline gets good overall pressure. So that's coaching, not Mayhew. 15 picks was average, 7 fumbles recovered was low. Again bad luck recovery rate.

Run game is finally better now with 10 good games in 2013. 6 bad were due to injuries to Calvin, Bush and Waddle. 2012 and 2011 there was less run support. 6 games is still costly but again that's injuries not Mayhew.

I don't concede anything. There is a reason for the lack of support and it's not Mayhew failing to add talent.

 

[LKP]

If Burleson (16 games over 2 years), Young (22 games in 2012/2013 causing Durham to play), Broyles (13 games plus limited when he did play), Best (26 games in 2011/2012) and Calvin (2013 playing hurt) stayed healthier you guys might have a point against Mayhew. But you don't. Talent was there and the weapons rebuild is complete with Tate and Ebron and Bush. So now it's time to shine for Stafford.

Defense new scheme. Dline and LBs and safety clearly set. CBs have potential with Slay and Mathis especially Slay in this scheme.

Better recovery rate for fumbles helps our defense.

Run game, I'll take 10 good games again with less fumbles. A better recovery rate could fix that.

 

[tomdalton22]

If Burleson (16 games over 2 years), Young (22 games in 2012/2013 causing Durham to play), Broyles (13 games plus limited when he did play), Best (26 games in 2011/2012) and Calvin (2013 playing hurt) stayed healthier you guys might have a point against Mayhew. But you don't. Talent was there and the weapons rebuild is complete with Tate and Ebron and Bush. So now it's time to shine for Stafford.

Defense new scheme. Dline and LBs and safety clearly set. CBs have potential with Slay and Mathis especially Slay in this scheme.

Better recovery rate for fumbles helps our defense.

Run game, I'll take 10 good games again with less fumbles. A better recovery rate could fix that.

That is a lot of "IF'S"

When the Lions go 8-8 this season what excuses will you make?

 

[LKP]

That is a lot of "IF'S"

When the Lions go 8-8 this season what excuses will you make?

They won't. 11-5 and playoffs.

But if they do I'm sure it will be injury related.

 

[cheeno]

They won't. 11-5 and playoffs.

But if they do I'm sure it will be injury related.

Go with new scheme, you need something fresh or your viewers will lose interest.

 

[LKP]

And even if Stafford and his weapons have 19 combined picks of fault again. I still think it's very likely the Lions offensive fumbles drop to around 10 and we have 27-28 turnovers forced by our defense instead of 22 (new scheme). This will lead to double digit wins too with Staffords production (30 plus TDs and good on 3rd down and moving the ball).

Lions fixed everything that they needed but they need only 1 or 2 more things to go there way while holding steady on TD production (44), pass pro and defensive stop %.

Better run game (12-13 good games instead of 10)
More turnovers (28 instead of 22)
Less fumbles lost (10 instead of 15)
Better 2nd/3rd weapon production (less drops, more YAC/YPC, more separation to help completion %)
Stafford reduces his ints
Weapons reduce their ints

Fix one of those things. Lions win 10-11 games. Fix more. Super bowl

 

[LKP]

Go with new scheme, you need something fresh or your viewers will lose interest.

Injuries are facts. Scheme problems are tough to gauge unless players come out and say they didn't know the correct play.