To everyone who says Ebron can be like Graham

[LKP]

I think the lions aggressiveness was built the right way and will hit home more. Also have faith the new dc will smartly only rush four at the correct time.

Having 7 back you can still give up the big play. More time is worse for a secondary than a quick hitter to beat a blitz

 

[lgolfer]

It does matter what they looked like when making an assessment of the players going forward. It doesn't help them get in the playoffs in 2013 but you can have more confidence in them if you analyze in detail and truly understand what caused the losses and what can be avoided

I do agree that it can help to "analyze in detail and truly understand what caused the losses and what can be avoided." Unfortunately, just because you identify the problems doesn't mean they always get fixed and new problems always pop up.

In essence, I agree with all of your above post. The thing I disagree with is when you say a team "was really such and such a record" instead of what their actual record was.

 

[LKP]

I do agree that it can help to "analyze in detail and truly understand what caused the losses and what can be avoided." Unfortunately, just because you identify the problems doesn't mean they always get fixed and new problems always pop up.

In essence, I agree with all of your above post. themselves I disagree with is when you say a team "was really such and such a record" instead of what their actual record was.

If they played it again 12-4 is in the cards. Unable to prove or disprove but going forward there is more than 7-9 confidence. Upgrades were made to experience, schemes, players and coaches. Considering all teams changes and comparing them to lions talent, 10 plus wins is a higher probability. Could they shoot themselves in the foot again with turnovers. Yes but if they don't watch out for a lot of lions wins

 

[mhughes0021]

Adrian Peterson is going down as one of the greatest RBs of all time. Value. But seeing as no one drafts RBs in the first anymore because there is no value to it because of the guys you mentioned you are really making the point for us - TE, like RB is a position you can find value in later rounds. If Ebron is one of the top TEs in the league next year he'll join other third a fourth rounders in that company. If Ebron is CJ or AP that's great value.

I don't tend to agree with Drew Sharp, but he's takes a similar stance.

http://www.freep.com/article/20140510/COL08/305100023/

Unrelated note: Who the fuck takes two TEs in the first round in 5 years?

copied n pasted the sharp article just to show im not the only one that's grumpy when I have to watch a mayhew draft

Drew Sharp: Lions trading up for linebacker nothing to celebrate

This is how the Lions roll.

Every attempt at convincing everyone that they got it right in the draft is met with historical evidence that they likely failed, once again offering that tug-of-war between hope and truth.

They traded up in the second round Friday, landing Brigham Young outside linebacker Kyle Van Noy. He might be a good player. Who knows?

The Lions’ aggressiveness in moving up after they targeted a specific defensive player certainly will pacify those still angry that they invested the 10th overall selection in the first round on a luxury tight end/wide receiver hybrid, but who nonetheless believe that the Lions will correct any potential early errors in the later rounds.

But how much success has general manager Martin Mayhew had in trading up in the early rounds?

He moved up late in the first round in 2010 to land running back Jahvid Best despite a chronicled history of concussions. Best is out of the league because of a recurrence of that medical history.

A year later, Mayhew traded up to get a later second round pick in running back Mikel Leshoure. He’s currently barely clinging to a roster spot, branded as a draft bust until further notice.

Explain to me again why anyone should instinctively trust that the Lions got it right this time trading up to take Van Noy?

Third time’s a charm?

“We started calling at the very top (of the second round) with Houston and worked our way all the way down until we got somebody where we had a good match as far as draft choices,” Mayhew said.

The Lions were in recovery mode Friday. They had to take a defensive player in the second round after selecting tight end Eric Ebron in the first round Thursday. They needed two defensive starters from the second and third round.

But … then they selected starting center Dominic Raiola’s heir apparent in the third round with Arkansas center Travis Swanson.

So let me get this straight. It was crazy adding to the Lions’ defensive tackle depth taking Aaron Donald at No. 10 overall because they’re likely losing either Ndamukong Suh or Nick Fairley following this season, but it’s perfectly sane bypassing defensive secondary help in the third round to find a center-in-waiting when you allegedly must win now?

Afterward, Mayhew conveyed his confidence in the Lions’ defense. Not taking a cornerback Friday night means he has full confidence that 2013 second-round pick Darius Slay has gone through the customary rookie cornerback indoctrination and is poised to become a solid every down contributor this season.

Mayhew’s basically staking his future as Lions’ GM beyond this season on the hope that he finally scored on a second round pick.

Explain to me again why anyone should instinctively trust that the Lions got it right this time?

The criticism surrounding the first two days of the Lions’ draft won’t ebb anytime soon. They’ve yet to prove that they understand anything about evaluating actual draft value.

Green Bay drafted Fresno State receiver Davante Adams with the 53rd overall pick and Denver took Indiana receiver Cody Latimer with the 56nd overall pick.

I mention those two teams because the feeble defense of the Eric Ebron selection at 10th overall Thursday hinges on the Lions compiling a collection of worthy offensive targets comparable to the Broncos and the Packers — widely considered the two best receiving corps in the league.

But only one of Denver and Green Bay’s premier receivers were originally drafted in the first round. Two were undrafted. Whereas the Lions invested three top-20 overall picks on their primary receiving corps — Calvin Johnson, Brandon Pettigrew and now Ebron.

Explain to me again why there’s confidence that the Lions got it right when their past and the present suggests otherwise?

 

[Mitchrapp]

Sharp is an idiot.

 

[tonyballs]

I stopped reading after Drew Sharp. He's a hack...

 

[inkfreq]

In this article Sharp questions the Lions for using three first round picks on offensive targets...

And also says the Lions should have taken Aaron Donald because we will likely lose Duh or Fairley after the season.

So three first round offensive weapons is bad? But Suh, Fairley, Ansah, and Donald would have been fucking genius?

Three players taken in the first round at the same position? Brilliant. Maybe next three years we can draft three kicker returners in the first round. Because we have already invested into the offense and the defense. Isn't it time special teams got some love.

 

[dubbsco]

I had a random thought while I was going for a run, and I really hope someone can clear up my confusion on this logic. There are some people, here and other places who were fine with the Ebron pick because a DB will take 2-3 years to develop. Fair enough. Why are those same people okay with the Swanson pick, knowing he won't be ready to be a solid NFL starter for 2-3 years? Even though DBs may take 2-3 years to develop, is that a reason to be allergic to them because this team needs to win right now? How can we assume that a guy like Clinton Dix or Dennard won't immediately be better than what the Lions have on the field right now simply on talent alone?

 

[brewer229]

I had a random thought while I was going for a run, and I really hope someone can clear up my confusion on this logic. There are some people, here and other places who were fine with the Ebron pick because a DB will take 2-3 years to develop. Fair enough. Why are those same people okay with the Swanson pick, knowing he won't be ready to be a solid NFL starter for 2-3 years? Even though DBs may take 2-3 years to develop, is that a reason to be allergic to them because this team needs to win right now? How can we assume that a guy like Clinton Dix or Dennard won't immediately be better than what the Lions have on the field right now simply on talent alone?

There is a difference between getting a guy that takes 2 to 3 years in the 1st round vs a guy that takes 2 to 3 in the 3rd. With your 1st round you want a guy that can contribute right away. It is more acceptable to take "projects" from the 3rd on.

You can't assume HaHa or Denard would automatically be worse. You have to assume that the coaches looked at the players they have and compared them to what was available in the draft and decided they were better off with what they have on the roster.

My opinion is they can improve with what they have. The d-line while not putting up prolific sack numbers, did generate a lot of pressure. The issue was they played a soft coverage, giving the QB a lot of open easy short throws.

I can't find the stat to back it up, I think it was published during a game. The QBs release time vs the Lions was around .5 seconds less than the average. I think with a little more aggressive coverage scheme the lions defense could improve in the passing game.

What we do know for sure is that we need multiple offensive weapons for our team do be successful. We were an injury to Tate from being in the same position we were last year.

 

[dubbsco]

Brewer, the Lions were near the bottom of the league in pass defense. I think it would be fair to assume that by adding a top-flight secondary player, you are going to improve those numbers, whether it be this upcoming season or the next.

Do we really need multiple offensive weapons? Every Super Bowl winner in the past few years have had top defenses, and functional offenses. They had enough to keep you guessing, but did not have amazing talent. Seattle is rolling out Tate and Baldwin, Baltimore had Torrey Smith and Dennis Pitta. This team has enough offense. They didn't need more. It's time for Stafford to make his players look better, and not require this team to compile 8,000 weapons for him.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Brewer, the Lions were near the bottom of the league in pass defense. I think it would be fair to assume that by adding a top-flight secondary player, you are going to improve those numbers, whether it be this upcoming season or the next.

Do we really need multiple offensive weapons? Every Super Bowl winner in the past few years have had top defenses, and functional offenses. They had enough to keep you guessing, but did not have amazing talent. Seattle is rolling out Tate and Baldwin, Baltimore had Torrey Smith and Dennis Pitta. This team has enough offense. They didn't need more. It's time for Stafford to make his players look better, and not require this team to compile 8,000 weapons for him.

Stafford has made CJ the best WR (statistically, over the last 3 years) ever....Durham serviceable, and Pettigrew look good from time to time.

Stafford makes players better......but they're so terrible, making them look serviceable is all he can do. I think he makes Tate a GOOD #2 and Ebron a star. Just my opinion.

Is he Manning or Brady.....no.....but if you put those expectations on him that's your own damn fault.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Stafford has made CJ the best WR (statistically, over the last 3 years) ever....Durham serviceable, and Pettigrew look good from time to time.

Stafford makes players better......but they're so terrible, making them look serviceable is all he can do. I think he makes Tate a GOOD #2 and Ebron a star. Just my opinion.

Is he Manning or Brady.....no.....but if you put those expectations on him that's your own damn fault.

I don't think so bud. CJ is a beast, with as many times as we throw the ball..1500 plus yards is a given. I think you have it reversed..but thanks for giving me a laugh..

 

[dubbsco]

Booger, if it wasn't for the fact that CJ is the biggest freak in the entire sporting world, Stafford would be up shit creek without a paddle. Maybe this upcoming season, Stafford won't make Calvin have to jump 90 feet to catch a pass.

 

[dubbsco]

And I'm going to damn well put high expectations on him, he's a #1 pick that the team pays a TON of money to, if he doesn't look like Manning or Brady, at least he should look like he belongs in the same ballpark.

 

[mhughes0021]

There is a difference between getting a guy that takes 2 to 3 years in the 1st round vs a guy that takes 2 to 3 in the 3rd. With your 1st round you want a guy that can contribute right away. It is more acceptable to take "projects" from the 3rd on.

You can't assume HaHa or Denard would automatically be worse. You have to assume that the coaches looked at the players they have and compared them to what was available in the draft and decided they were better off with what they have on the roster.

My opinion is they can improve with what they have. The d-line while not putting up prolific sack numbers, did generate a lot of pressure. The issue was they played a soft coverage, giving the QB a lot of open easy short throws.

I can't find the stat to back it up, I think it was published during a game. The QBs release time vs the Lions was around .5 seconds less than the average. I think with a little more aggressive coverage scheme the lions defense could improve in the passing game.

What we do know for sure is that we need multiple offensive weapons for our team do be successful. We were an injury to Tate from being in the same position we were last year.

I disagree in regards to centers. They aren't highly coveted andtherefor never go early. So when you get one in rds 2 or 3 they typically are nfl ready starters. Ours will sit the bench. Centers dont need time to be "groomed." It was a wasted pick in my opinion until he sees the field.

 

[Mitchrapp]

I disagree in regards to centers. They aren't highly coveted andtherefor never go early. So when you get one in rds 2 or 3 they typically are nfl ready starters. Ours will sit the bench. Centers dont need time to be "groomed." It was a wasted pick in my opinion until he sees the field.

Is he not ready or will he sit the bench because Raiola is still here? Why should we wait until we have no center to take one? And who says Raiola stays, he counts little against the cap..

Plus with no 4th until the comps. I don't see a problem grabbing him if they thought they couldn't wait..

Also, who could we have taken that would start no matter what? If you think he's a good player just went too early in round or year..it beats another TE :nod:

 

[mhughes0021]

Is he not ready or will he sit the bench because Raiola is still here? Why should we wait until we have no center to take one? And who says Raiola stays, he counts little against the cap..

Plus with no 4th until the comps. I don't see a problem grabbing him if they thought they couldn't wait..

Also, who could we have taken that would start no matter what? If you think he's a good player just went too early in round or year..it beats another TE :nod:

Kareem Martin, Moncrief, Nix would have contributed much more than swammy, Samsonite, whatever his name is...this year. Mayhew does this lkp thing all the time where he picks guys that might contribute in the future. In his case, rarely does it ever come to fruition. Im sure if Crayola leaves next year then swammy will play...still means we lost a year worth of value. Hey, if we woke up this morning and Crayola was released....then fine id have no argument. But even mayhew isn't that dumb...

 

[cheeno]

Dumb and dumber

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Kareem Martin, Moncrief, Nix would have contributed much more than swammy, Samsonite, whatever his name is...this year. Mayhew does this lkp thing all the time where he picks guys that might contribute in the future. In his case, rarely does it ever come to fruition. Im sure if Crayola leaves next year then swammy will play...still means we lost a year worth of value. Hey, if we woke up this morning and Crayola was released....then fine id have no argument. But even mayhew isn't that dumb...

Packers lost 3 YEARS of value with the Aaron Rodgers pick......what idiots!!!

 

[cheeno]

Packers lost 3 YEARS of value with the Aaron Rodgers pick......what idiots!!!

Are you seriously comparing the center position to the quarterback position? And sitting behind Crapola to sitting behind an HOFer and Super Bowl winner? And a top team picking constantly 20 or higher to us a team in win now mode picking ten and above. In that case Seattle should've criticized for trading back or San Fran for picking developmental players. In you're own words what an idiot.